Opinion
Commissioner Corner
With all the debate and discussion about how best to fight crime and
meet all the rest of Clatsop County’s public safety needs, it’s easy
to forget there are real people behind all those statistics.
I’d like to introduce you to one of those people.
Noah Tollefson was born and raised in Clatsop County, and he’s
probably a familiar name to many county residents. He was to me – he
attended school with my daughter. But others probably know him mostly
from his frequent brushes with the law.
Noah got hooked on drugs as a teenager, and by the time he was 18 was
already involved with the adult criminal justice system. He stole money
and property to feed his addiction, racked up nine felony convictions
for burglary, theft and drug possession, and did three stints in prison
in Oregon and Idaho.
Now 27, Noah admits he was well on his way to becoming a career
criminal. But he was able to turn his life around.
A big motivation was the birth of his son in January 2007. The others
were two local programs designed to help people escape the drug
lifestyle.
Throughout his drug-using and law-breaking years Noah said he resisted any attempts to turn him around. Substance abuse treatment, boys’ homes, boot camps – nothing worked. “ I refused to do anything. I didn’t follow any of the rules,” he said. In late 2006 he was enrolled in Drug Court, a relatively new approach to fighting drug-related crime that Clatsop County launched seven years ago. As part of Drug Court, Noah had to attend substance-abuse treatment, take random urinalysis tests, meet regularly with the program’s parole officer, Barry Hazel, and make weekly appearances in front of Circuit Court Judge Phil Nelson, who reviewed his progress. Noah admits that at first he treated Drug Court like most of the programs he’d failed before. He had his share of violations, and was close to being kicked out of the program at one point. But Judge Nelson and Hazel give him one final chance to straighten out, and Noah, faced with the real threat of losing his child, buckled down and met all the requirements. He graduated from the program last spring. “I felt I was under very close watch, that I was being held accountable for all my actions,” he said.
Noah also participated in another new program, the Community Corrections Transition Center. The facility in Warrenton houses parole violators and low-level offenders in a dormitory-style setting, where the clients are able to leave for jobs, treatment sessions and other authorized activities but must return at set times. Noah did two stints at the Transition Center. He said being “half-way locked up” at the facility was in many ways tougher to handle than the total lack of freedom he experienced when he was in prison. But what the Transition Center offered that made the most difference, he said, was the opportunity to expand his education, land a job, make some money and find a home while he was still in the facility. That’s a stark contrast to prison, where Noah would be released time and again with no support when he got out, and would immediately revert back to his criminal ways. “I was able to utilize the resources they had (in the Transition Center), so I had everything ready to go when I got out,” he said. Today Noah has found work with a local contractor and shares custody of his young son. He’s also broken his ties with friends from his drug-using days, and fills his free time with surfing, golf and hunting instead of narcotics.
We’re all aware of the challenges our local criminal justice system faces, including our overcrowded county jail that turns people loose after only days or even hours behind bars. The county commissioners recently received a report from Voorhis Associates that lays out options for replacing our outdated jail with a new, bigger facility. It’s important that law-breakers pay the consequences for their actions. But jail cells alone can’t solve our community’s problems with substance abuse. As I learned from Noah, even the threat of incarceration is no deterrent for some people deep into the drug lifestyle. “I got to the point I didn’t care about the consequences of what I did,” he said. “I got used to (prison), it became acceptable – that was the worst part.” Noah is one of 78 people who’ve successfully completed Drug Court. Of those, only 15 have committed new crimes, a success rate that’s far higher than for criminals who don’t participate in the program. The Transition Center, meanwhile, houses people who most likely would be out in the community with little or no supervision. Programs like these can help break the cycle of crime and substance abuse that keeps so many people cycling through our criminal justice system again and again.
“I was the type of person that when people heard my name, they justshook their heads,” Noah said. “It’s important for people to see that people like me can change.”
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By Rick Balkins from the article Where are you getting 4-131 info?.On Sep 5, 6:31 PM, Rick Balkins wrote:
Anyway, I voted how I feel about the issue whether you agree or disagree with me, I’m not going to …
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What convinced me to vote the way I did?
… By Patrick McGee from the article Where are you getting 4-131 info?.
105 Comments
On Aug 3, 7:11 PM, Christine Bridgens wrote:
NCO, The Commissioner’s Corner segment is a great idea--Thanks for the high quality online journalism and investigative reporting. The stories on the County Fair were excellent. (Actually, I really liked the “backdrop” for the 4H booth!) 4H Club members deserve all the credit and publicity that they can get. It was a pleasure visiting with them at the Fair, and learning about all the work which went into their projects. Thanks again for your coverage.
On Aug 4, 3:39 PM, Patrick McGee wrote:
Investigative reporting?
Good lord in heaven!
Excuse me Ms. Bridgens but you have sugar drooling down your chin.
On Aug 4, 4:10 PM, Guest wrote:
And the Cyber Bully again wants blood running dowh his chin.
On Aug 4, 6:07 PM, Patrick McGee wrote:
I’m not bullying.
It’s really not necessary to lay all these plastic accolades on this site, it speaks for itself as to its legitimacy and its future will prove it out one way or the other.
On Aug 4, 7:07 PM, A Fan wrote:
NCO-The Voice Of The REAL grassroots people.
NCO is the best cyber resource for what’s happening on the lower Columbia. Nothing else even comes close.
On Aug 4, 7:31 PM, Patrick McGee wrote:
On Aug 4, 7:07 PM, A Fan wrote:
NCO-The Voice Of The REAL grassroots people.
NCO is the best cyber resource for what’s happening on the lower Columbia. Nothing else even comes close.
It is indeed, amongst its readers but, nobody seems to know who any of them are.
The best news “Nobody” can read.
Might help this “Cyber Rag” if some of you would stand up and proudly proclaim, under your own and verifiable names that you actually do support this thing but, we all know that’s not likely don’t we?
On Aug 4, 9:24 PM, Beach Boy wrote:
The best thing NCO could do is keep McGee from blogging on this site. He is an idiot. Every day he is on here about any topic. Apparently, he has nothing else to do. GET A LIFE Patrick. (or move)
On Aug 4, 9:53 PM, Rick Balkins wrote:
Patrick,
Chill down a bit. There are obvious internet-related reasons WHY some folks are not going to share their REAL name. Example: Violent freaks may conduct physical harm to them if they disagree with them. Another is IDENTITY theft. Majority is caused over the internet. There are reasons and they don’t always know you, personally.
On Aug 4, 9:56 PM, Rick Balkins wrote:
I also understand your end, Patrick. Some people don’t want harassment at work or at home or in public just because of their view. They have experienced it in the past. There are some less then savory folks in this community who has issues.
On Aug 5, 1:20 AM, likely wrote:
On Aug 4, 7:31 PM, Patrick McGee wrote:
Might help this “Cyber Rag”
this site does just fine the way it is and, besides, who would take suggestions from someone who has failed to build local based web community as many times as you have? So, your unsolicited suggestions of “help” are bogus and invalid.
Since “nobody” is exactly forcing you to partake anyway and editorial policy here bugs you so much then why dont you shove off and just go play with your invisible friends on your own sites.
You dont bring anything here except heat, discontent, static and noise.
On Aug 5, 1:37 AM, Jemma Nasaka wrote:
McGee whined:"I’m not bullying. It’s really not necessary to lay all these plastic accolades on this site, it speaks for itself as to its legitimacy and its future will prove it out ...
Yeah, you are. And you’ve been saying that this site will prove its self out since 2006. At what point is it “proof”? One year, five years, twenty years? Get off your duff, go and investigate a story for yourself for once instead of cut n pasting or quit your bitching and whining about your betters. Ban the troll. He just whines about the site. Why does he keep reading it?
On Aug 5, 11:39 AM, Patrick McGee wrote:
Sniff...sni...sni....sniff!
Yeah, there you go ban an individual with an opinion that may vary from the others.
“Geeze Louise”
On Aug 5, 11:59 AM, Smith wrote:
P. Mcgee loves the attention,(big ego) even when he is wrong, which is 99% of the time.
He follows in J. Marquis footsteps, loves attention (big ego) before all.
He that would be a leader must be a bridge.
_welch proverb
On Aug 5, 11:59 AM, Rick Balkins wrote:
It’s not the issue that you have your own opinion. That is not the issue. It is how you present your opinion and how you act to others who have opinions as well as how you react to others that do taunt you or reached a point of not ever liking you or wanting anything to do with you.
On Aug 5, 12:03 PM, Rick Balkins wrote:
In other words, take a chill pill and don’t waste your time with those people.
For the rest of you, just stop! Stop statements like “P.McGee loves the attention, (big ego) even when he is wrong, which is 99% of the time. It is the statements like “...which is 99% of the time” that is not helpful.
On Aug 5, 12:03 PM, Ann Samuelson wrote:
Just a quick note to ask that folks give real input that will make our community a better place. The purpose behind my idea to write these articles periodically is to invite discussion and generate energy and ideas to improve Clatsop County, and to recognize things that work. I appreciate comments re: youth center, etc.
On Aug 5, 12:05 PM, Rick Balkins wrote:
Enough of the attitude and snide remarks on all sides.
Try to converse without use of snide remarks and respect each others view points. Is that OK? If so respond with OK.
On Aug 5, 12:07 PM, Rick Balkins wrote:
I agree, Ann.
On Aug 5, 1:23 PM, Patrick McGee wrote:
On Aug 5, 12:03 PM, Ann Samuelson wrote:
I appreciate comments re: youth center, etc.
This discussion would certainly warrant some more discussion Ann as there were some very good ideas floated so far from a few people.
Perhaps the the next Commissioners Corner topic.
On Aug 5, 9:26 PM, AnotherAstorian wrote:
Oh hey..wait a minute
We go from a Commissioner wishing to give an update…
to a literal (very weird) interaction between members
What the heck!?
A Commissioner wishes to discuss issues here and you bozos just take off on your own?
Wow..Personally, I really LIKE the Commissioners Corner, and HOPE that some people here will let our Commissioners speak their peace...JEEZE!!!!!!
Ann, you might want to repost, since this obviously got off on the wrong foot...thank you!
On Aug 5, 9:34 PM, AnotherAstorian wrote:
Ann...even if you don’t repost this same subject, please don’t hesitate to post in the future. Although I’m not in your district, I respect you a great deal, and value your ideas for our County
On Aug 6, 4:58 AM, Ann Samuelson wrote:
So for the sake of moving this in a positive direction, I’d like to hear what other issues matter to people that live here that I can research and write about. I very much appreciate NCO providing this forum, and respectfully ask that the Commissioners Corner be what it is intended and not a vehicle to slam this blog and others. To be continued......
Thanks in advance!
On Aug 8, 5:49 PM, Taylor Sands wrote:
this sure is a better, more “open forum” than the notoriously disgraceful, slanted and biased Daily Astorian. My question could be how can this site become an even more effective “clearing house” between the public and members of local government offices, boads and agencies.
On Aug 8, 10:14 PM, Ann...can you respond to this wrote:
On a different subject...just read that in a couple of weeks, the fairgrounds will be the site of a 3 day music fest (art community fundraiser hosting a variety of bands) including camping in the fields, beer garden, foods, showers, etc. As a close neighbor of the fair grounds, who will be monitoring the event for security? Did the county commissioners have any input or approval of this event? It probably will go very smoothly, but I hope this event isn’t setting the stage for larger entertainment campouts at the fairgrounds! Heaven help us - isn’t this the Woodstock generation...HA.
On Aug 8, 11:22 PM, Chicken Hirsch wrote:
who will be monitoring the event for security?...Heaven help us - isn’t this the Woodstock generation
Come on, it will be highly likely that the average age of the attendees will be somewhere in the mid-50s. Just how wild do you think it’s going to get? I doubt the performers who are all, except in some cases, in their mid-60s are going to be pumping out the kind of energy they could 40 years ago. Let the geezer baby boomers party, for God’s sake, they’ve earned it.
So when Country Joe leads “The Fish Cheer” just relax and get into it.
On Aug 9, 10:05 AM, sheeeeesh, you do not even live out here wrote:
Aren’t you getting ridiculous? If the event’s a fiasco its the commissioners fault, if its a success its the people who planned it? This is the art community. Owned lock, stock and barrel by them. The person who approved it is the manager of the fairgrounds. That’s it.
I hope more events like this are planned, even though the highest incidents of drunk driving are the 50 & 60 crowd, according to the Astoria Police Dispatch, even though we like to blame our young people.
On Aug 9, 2:06 PM, Chicken Hirsch wrote:
This is the art community
It is? Oh, yeah I guess I heard about that. One of them got stuck with some uninsurable white elephant of a bldng and now that it’s going the way of all the other uninsurable old bldngs. that used to dot the river bank, the guy is trying to hustle the public to pick up tab. I dont care much for the “arts community. About the only thing they’re good for is whinning too much
On Aug 9, 4:54 PM, Art for Lng is what I'd like to see wrote:
Good for them, and our insurance rates don’t go up! So don’t go to the event if you don’t like what its for, but realistically, without art this world would be a pretty dismal place. Every ant colony needs a few grasshoppers.
On Aug 10, 12:20 PM, guest wrote:
Have you ever seen the art that comes out of that place? Yuck! And Chicken is right, Nebeker was trying to unload that white elephant for years, and now that a disaster struck there is nothing dearer to his heart. B.S. It was a worthless building before the storm and it will still be worthless after the concerts.
On Aug 10, 1:57 PM, Chicken Hirsch wrote:
On Aug 10, 12:20 PM, guest wrote:
Have you ever seen the art that comes out of that place?
No, but it must be some pretty high end stuff! Recalling all the ink it got in the paper about the economic loss sustained by Nebeker when the insurance wouldnt cover the half million bucks worth of “unsold” art that got blown away or water damaged. That was a black day for art lovers around the world, eh?
On Aug 10, 3:53 PM, john wrote:
Art for Lng is what I’d like to see wrote:
“without art this world would be a pretty dismal place”
_________________________________________________________________________________________
The world? Yes.
Astoria? Well, the great percentage of the “art” turned out by so called local “artists” isn’t worth the medium it’s created from. This area has seen an upswing in the population of graduates and drops from pretentious school. I’m guessing but eventually they will thin out due to natural causes.
On Aug 10, 4:02 PM, Patrick McGee wrote:
On Aug 8, 5:49 PM, Taylor Sands wrote:
this sure is a better, more “open forum” than the notoriously disgraceful, slanted and biased Daily Astorian. My question could be how can this site become an even more effective “clearing house” between the public and members of local government offices, boads and agencies.
Don’t you hate how that rag rewuires accountability?
Geesh!!!!
On Aug 10, 4:32 PM, You don't know what you're talking about wrote:
No, I hate how it rewires facts and slants news.
And you are an idiot if you think it requires accountability. Any bozo with a toss-away can write an email to the Daily Astorian with any name they want as long as they have a phone number with it. All DA does is call the number and ask if you wrote a letter to them. Guarantee you that’s how city, county and state workers publish their letters. You are a friggin joke to state that the Daily Astorian requires accountability. You haven’t a clue.
On Aug 10, 4:39 PM, section line wrote:
Yes, the Daily Astorian needs to be held accountable for their sleazy attempts at legitimate unbiased reporting and journalism as well as the their policy of keeping letters out of The Open Forum page because the writers have differing views or, more often than not, exposing the lies and manipulative omissions published in that...rag.
I applaud local government officials who come here or anywhere on the blogsphere to tell people who care what’s really going on. People who depend only on the local daily paper are getting a healthy ration of smoke blown up their tushes
On Aug 10, 7:59 PM, Patrick McGee wrote:
On Aug 10, 4:32 PM, You don’t know what you’re talking about wrote:
No, I hate how it rewires facts and slants news.
So some clown is going to go to the trouble to rig a bogus email and go to the expense of a bogus phone number to post a piece on “The DA” to avoid being accountable for what he/she says?
Looks the “Joke” and “Bozo” are real.
Say!.....You haven’t actually tried that have you?
On Aug 10, 8:32 PM, Ann Samuelson wrote:
In response to the question re the fairgrounds: There is a fairboard, and a staff Director as well. Calling the fairgrounds directly would be the best way to get your questions answered. County Commissioiners are not involved in the day to day operations of that facility.
On Aug 10, 11:03 PM, come off it wrote:
The “trouble” of “rigging” an email? Come off it McGee. How many you got? Everyone has at least one they use for newsletters and junk. Good lord. It takes less than a minute to set up. Anyone with a cell can use that phone # and use any name they want. You really think the Daily Astorian tracks down and verifies each name and address beyond the phone call? You are completely gullible to anything the Daily Astorian wants you to believe, aren’t you? The only time they doubt someone’s identity is if it is an opinion they don’t want to hear.
On Aug 10, 11:44 PM, Bea Hind wrote:
On Aug 10, 7:59 PM, Patrick McGee wrote:
... the trouble to rig a bogus email and go to the expense of a bogus phone number.
If an email account works and a phone number works then they aren’t “bogus”, they are genuine.
On the subject, the only thing genuinely bogus is The Daily Astorian. That news organ actually makes Fox News look Fair & Balanced
On Aug 11, 7:45 AM, Patrick McGee wrote:
On Aug 10, 4:32 PM, <b>You don’t know what you’re talking about wrote:
No, I hate how it rewires facts and slants news.
Any bozo with a toss-away can write an email to the Daily Astorian with any name they want as long as they have a phone number with it. All DA does is call the number and ask if you wrote a letter to them.</i>
Soory the scenario was developed by the bozo above, in italics.
And someone wouls be stupid enough to go to those lengths?
The DA should be striiped by all those recent awards right?
On Aug 11, 8:56 AM, Ann Samuelson wrote:
One more time, if we could focus here on community improvement, new ideas, and what it is the people want to learn about their county government that would be super.
On Aug 11, 9:04 AM, Wilhelm (Vickey) Gandolph Durst wrote:
Sorry, Mcgee, and as much as I hate to be the one who clues you in, every newspaper who pays dues to that association wins an “award”. It’s just a form of advertising. Like all advertising, it’s bought and paid for.
On Aug 11, 9:20 AM, Patrick McGee wrote:
On Aug 11, 8:56 AM, Ann Samuelson wrote:
One more time, if we could focus here on community improvement, new ideas, and what it is the people want to learn about their county government that would be super.
We all observe the workings of our County Government daily and in light of that, let me ask you: What is it you believe the people of Clatsop County want Ann?
On Aug 11, 9:24 AM, Patrick McGee wrote:
On Aug 11, 9:04 AM, Wilhelm (Vickey) Gandolph Durst wrote:
Sorry, Mcgee, and as much as I hate to be the one who clues you in, every newspaper who pays dues to that association wins an “award”. It’s just a form of advertising. Like all advertising, it’s bought and paid for.
I get it now, All newspapers are in collusion with these organizations and it’s all just shallow, industry back slapping, right?
I can see your loyalty to this kind of community resourse, NCO and Commissioner Samuelson’s reliance on your level of support.
On Aug 11, 9:55 AM, Rick Balkins wrote:
Dipsticks, here. Take a moment to listen and read and understand.
The Daily Astorian will not post a ficticious name that does not resemble a real name whatsoever. Posting a name like “Starship Enterprise” or an obvious character name like James Kirk (the name of the captain of the starship enterprise. However, if your name is really such then the Daily Astorian can request and will request that you come to the Daily Astorian office with proof that YOU are really that person.
On Aug 11, 9:55 AM, Rick Balkins wrote:
Using a ficticious name will likely cause you to not be published in the newspaper. It is also possible that if you use a fictitious name that a fellow family member could answer the phone call and say that “No such person at this address (or ...with this nuber)” or they may answer with “You got the wrong number, no person with that name lives here”.
The Daily Astorian will post your name as anonymous if you request it.
On Aug 11, 9:56 AM, Rick Balkins wrote:
The email address that you provide can be anything.
On Aug 11, 10:15 AM, Ann Landers wrote:
On Aug 11, 9:20 AM, Patrick McGee wrote:
What is it you believe the people of Clatsop County want, Ann?
It’s my belief that the people of Clatsop County want, most of all, for you to go back to where you came from.
On Aug 11, 10:41 AM, James Kirk wrote:
On Aug 11, 9:24 AM, Patrick McGee wrote:
I get it now, All newspapers are in collusion with these organizations and it’s all just shallow, industry back slapping, right?
uhh, yeah..that is right
On Aug 11, 9:24 AM, Patrick McGee wrote:
I can see your loyalty to this kind of community resourse, NCO and Commissioner Samuelson’s reliance on your level of support.
If we shouldnt be loyal on the local community level, then who should we be loyal too? NCO and Samuelson aren’t profit driven entities-these are people who really care about the local scene.
On Aug 11, 10:50 AM, Patrick McGee wrote:
“Captain Kirk” said:If we shouldnt be loyal on the local community level, then who should we be loyal too? NCO and Samuelson aren’t profit driven entities-these are people who really care about the local scene.
Well, let’s just see how in touch our esteemed Commissioner Samuelson is then as I have asked her to tell us what she believes it is the citizens of Clatsop County truly want.
You think she will give us an answer?
On Aug 11, 11:01 AM, Clarice Basseli wrote:
Sometimes these off topic tangents are annoying however surprisingly this time I learned quite a bit! I didn’t realize Daily Astorian’s meager posting requirements. According to the paper’s posted info the people posting here are correct. Any name that looks “normal” and has an email & phone number would be accepted. One of those instances of McGee saying that the paper holds people accountable so often I believed it! Bad on me.
On Aug 11, 11:05 AM, Clarice Basseli wrote:
I didn’t realize those awards the Daily Astorian keeps self congratulating itself on were simply news association awards, sort of like the ones advertising agencies vote on for themselves. Again, bad on me. It is sort of scary how insidious the printed word can be.
Ann, I would like to know about measure 4-131. How much of Clatsop County is surrounded by parks and recreation land? If a new cable company were to come into Clatsop County, would they have to get permits from the county to lay their cable?
On Aug 11, 11:10 AM, Patrick McGee wrote:
On Aug 11, 11:01 AM, Clarice Basseli wrote:
One of those instances of McGee saying that the paper holds people accountable so often I believed it! Bad on me.
That’s not a safe way to go through life “Baselli”, only reacting to and obeying, as fact, only what you are told without confirmation?
Oooops! You got us off subject again.
I’m still waiting for Ms. Samuelson’s wisdom on “The People’s” wants as she sees it.
On Aug 11, 11:14 AM, citizen mary wrote:
I would like to see the commissioners get behind a roller skating rink. Look what results happen when someone started the little houses at tapiola park.
On Aug 11, 11:14 AM, Patrick McGee wrote:
Clarice Bassali wrote:...Ann, I would like to know about measure 4-131. How much of Clatsop County is surrounded by parks and recreation land? If a new cable company were to come into Clatsop County, would they have to get permits from the county to lay their cable?
Uh-oh!!! You’re goona open a real can of worms on this one but, Ann please, fill us in.
After all, this is “Commissioner’s Corner” and it is a legitimate question
On Aug 11, 11:26 AM, Try again McGee wrote:
Good grief. The big answer is: All citizens want to feel as if they’ve been heard. Political Science, 101. Other than that, you asking for clarvoyancy. Jewell wants their roads to be fixed, Westport wants water, Cannon Beach wants safety during a catastrophe, Astoria wants a mitigation plan, etc. Is that what each citizen wants? Nope. Your question does nothing to clarify Samuelson’s position nor the direction that the BOCC is moving in. All it does is provide further fodder for argument.
On Aug 11, 11:43 AM, Clarice wrote:
I’ve already said bad on me. Love how you switch that, tho. “How dare you believe me without checking facts yourself!” as if it is the person who is reading what you write’s fault for believing you instead of holding YOURSELF accountable for what you write. Every time you post that the Daily Astorian holds people accountable either you are a blatant liar or an ignorant fool. Take ownership of that, hold yourself accountable.
On Aug 11, 11:46 AM, Rick Balkins wrote:
Every community in this county has their own concerns and wants. There isn’t many if any things that everyone wants. Every person has their own idea of what we want. Including the commissioners. You vote for them if they are supporting the issues that you support.
On Aug 11, 12:07 PM, tonia wrote:
Rick, maybe that’s a problem? We should vote for someone based on who they are and what they’ve done rather than what they say on certain current issues. One topic candidates lose their usefulness pretty fast. If you want a rink and get the rink, what then? If you hate LNG and it was defeated, what then?
On Aug 11, 12:17 PM, Patrick McGee wrote:
On Aug 11, 11:26 AM, Try again McGee wrote:
Good grief. The big answer is: All citizens want to feel as if they’ve been heard. Political Science, 101.
Is this you Commissioner and is this your answer?
And you presume to call yourself a community leader?
On Aug 11, 12:25 PM, Rick Balkins wrote:
Tonia, very good point but that is also part of the intent of what I said. I said, “You vote for them if they are supporting the issues...”. I don’t consider them supporting if it is only words. They are supporting if they are taking action and DOING something about it. That’s supporting.
Words alone are cheap. I’ll proceed later on this topic.
On Aug 11, 12:39 PM, try again wrote:
NO, it isn’t the commissioner. Once again you are lying, Patrick. And you call yourself accountable just because you use a name?
On Aug 11, 1:34 PM, Dave "Okie" Griffith wrote:
Patrick McGee, what do you believe the people of Clatsop County want?
On Aug 11, 1:36 PM, Patrick McGee wrote:
On Aug 11, 12:39 PM, try again wrote:
NO, it isn’t the commissioner. Once again you are lying, Patrick. And you call yourself accountable just because you use a name?
So, a person asks a question and they are liars?
Tsk, tsk, tsk.
On Aug 11, 2:57 PM, Patrick McGee wrote:
On Aug 11, 1:34 PM, Dave “Okie” Griffith wrote:
Patrick McGee, what do you believe the people of Clatsop County want?
This ain’t my corner “Opie” and it ain’t about me and I ain’t no Commuissioner.
The Commissioner stated what she wanted, good, sound questions, I asked them and still, no answers.
What does that tell you “Opie”?
On Aug 11, 3:56 PM, Duh wrote:
That you aren’t asking good sound questions.
On Aug 11, 4:00 PM, Holly wrote:
It looks like the “Healthy Start” program is going to be discontinued in Clatsop County because the state is unable to generate the funds needed to support it and it cannot support itself. What are your feelings on the demise of that program and do you think there will be a noticable consequence of loosing it locally? What area of the county used it the most?
On Aug 11, 4:10 PM, AnotherAstorian wrote:
Clarice, thank you for asking the 64,000 question, because that’s what is SO WRONG with this referendum.
Part 1:
f 4-131 fails, NOBODY will be able to get a variance thru OPR land...nobody. Nevermind what it’s for, the Commissioners won’t be able to grant a CONDITIONAL USE permit through that type of land.
The piece of land that started this broo-ha-ha isn’t a park, hasn’t ever BEEN a park, and will never BE a park. It is privately owned land that happens to be zoned Open Space. (to be continued)
On Aug 11, 4:10 PM, AnotherAstorian wrote:
Part two:
If everyone who reads NCO sees this, hopefully they spread the word - the anti-pipeline people are LYING TO YOU...No Commission is ever going to grant a permit through an actual PARK, get real! This is simply a delay tactic, so they can wave their little signs and say “WE WON - NO LNG PIPELINES IN PARKS!-WOO HOO!” Never mind that there is no such THING as an LNG pipeline, those idiots
PLEASE let’s pass this referendum and let our Planning Commission and County Commissioners do what they are appointed & elected to do.
On Aug 11, 7:16 PM, Patrick McGee wrote:
On Aug 11, 4:10 PM, AnotherAstorian wrote:
The piece of land that started this broo-ha-ha isn’t a park, hasn’t ever BEEN a park, and will never BE a park. It is privately owned land that happens to be zoned Open Space.
But it is zoned as such.
What would be the odds of changing the zoning?
I guess all ASSUMED it was unnecessary because of the players, maybe, and everything would be hunky dorey and as usual go without a hitch but, oh-oh!, those pesky citizens jumped out of the woodwork and challenged it.
On Aug 11, 9:16 PM, try again wrote:
However we all know how off-kelter your guesses and assumptions are. Full of gossip, innuendos and misinformation, as usual.
On Aug 11, 10:25 PM, Dave "Okie" Griffith wrote:
On Aug 11, 2:57 PM, Patrick McGee wrote:
This ain’t my corner “Opie” and it ain’t about me and I ain’t no Commuissioner.
The Commissioner stated what she wanted, good, sound questions, I asked them and still, no answers.
What does that tell you “Opie”?
1. That you ask really dumb questions.
2. That you cant tell a “k” from a “p”.
On Aug 12, 8:19 AM, Patrick McGee wrote:
Brilliant retort “Opie”.
On Aug 12, 9:28 AM, Brian Balda wrote:
Do you people actually attempt to solve anything or do you just talk about it? Whats the point of saying you want to make a difference and resting on your laurels? Seems to me people just like to say things and back them up with no action. Thats why problems stay problems and solutions stay extinct.
On Aug 12, 9:49 AM, Patrick McGee wrote:
On Aug 12, 9:28 AM, Brian Balda wrote:
Do you people actually attempt to solve anything or do you just talk about it? Whats the point of saying you want to make a difference and resting on your laurels? Seems to me people just like to say things and back them up with no action. Thats why problems stay problems and solutions stay extinct.
Bingo!!!!!
On Aug 12, 11:09 AM, AnotherAstorian wrote:
Patrick - I beg to differ, the land in question is NOT zoned as a park, it just happens to fall into the multi-zoning of “Open Space, Parks & Recreation”. It is zoned as open space.
On Aug 12, 11:12 AM, Betsy Witt wrote:
On Aug 12, 9:28 AM, Brian Balda wrote:
Do you people actually attempt to solve anything or do you just talk about it?
Mcgee isn’t interested in practical solutions, Mr. Balda, he is more interested in attempting to create non-existant problems.
On Aug 12, 11:23 AM, Patrick McGee wrote:
On Aug 12, 11:09 AM, AnotherAstorian wrote:
Patrick - I beg to differ, the land in question is NOT zoned as a park, it just happens to fall into the multi-zoning of “Open Space, Parks & Recreation”. It is zoned as open space.
(OPR)Open Space, Parks And Recreaation Zone:
Section 3.582 Purpose:
The OPR zone is intended to provide for the conservation of open space; the protection and development of areas uniquely suited for outdoor recreation of designated scenic, natural and cultural resource areas.
On Aug 12, 11:31 AM, Patti wrote:
Brian, what is it you would like to see? When you say “you people” who do you mean? How soon do you want change? These “open forums allow business people to see what is working and what isn’t. What to funnel money into and what not to. They see that Balkins and Nyberg are determined people who rarely get pulled into the negative so would be good to work with, and they DO things. They see others as people who whine about their ideas not being “chosen” when they’ve done nothing but bully/lie to get their way. How quickly do you want change? What does change look like to you?
On Aug 12, 11:36 AM, Patrick McGee wrote:
On Aug 12, 11:12 AM, Betsy Witt wrote:
On Aug 12, 9:28 AM, Brian Balda wrote:
Do you people actually attempt to solve anything or do you just talk about it?
Mcgee isn’t interested in practical solutions, Mr. Balda, he is more interested in attempting to create non-existant problems.
And it seems the Ms. Witt has nothing more to add to solutuions either but more inane, vitriolic drivel.
Commissioner’s Corner this is?
On Aug 12, 11:44 AM, Patti wrote:
You have no idea how many of us come away from this forum with ideas for our service club, our churches, and our committees/councils. Ideas that can and do change our communities. You aren’t going to see the change here because it takes action. Here is where the messy stuff gets done. Grinding out the ideas. And critiqueing it. It is sad that people have to focus on the person instead of the ideas. Especially for those who seem to be hot wired to the computer and have the time to respond all day long to every single post. Most of us can check in once a day, maybe twice.
On Aug 12, 12:09 PM, Patrick McGee wrote:
OK Patti, I get your point and good luck with those ideas.
On Aug 12, 12:21 PM, Patti wrote:
Thank-you, Mr. Balda for sharing your concerns. You, too, can do more, if you chose. Make a presentation to the BOCC and tell them why jails aren’t working, but why something else will. Do your homework and tell them what else IS/HAS worked elsewhere. They are planning on going full bore ahead with the new jail and want everyone “on board”. Tell them why this doesn’t work for you, or how it will work for you. Get a group of people who have been “through” the system together to talk about what has worked and what hasn’t. You could even do consulting work for local governments.
On Aug 12, 12:53 PM, AnotherAstorian wrote:
And Brian, yes I do try to solve problems. On this issue, I’ve written letters to public officials and newspapers, and testified at every public hearing. Unfortunately, many of the silent majority don’t realize how important their voice is, which is why I talk to friends and neighbors all the time, encouraging them to get involved. Many have along the way, and more are getting involved every day.
Blogging and chatting back and forth on these forums IS one way to get involved - it gets people talking, and that’s a beginning.
On Aug 12, 1:51 PM, Jeff Johnson wrote:
As I learned from Noah, even the threat of incarceration is no deterrent for some people deep into the drug lifestyle.
I think the key word there is some people. It’s a given that there is and always has been a percentage of substance abusers amongst our population, but also that majority of them go undetected and don’t wind up in the system. Why? Because they don’t engage in violent crime and other anti-social behaviors. Jails are necessary.
On Aug 12, 2:02 PM, Patrick McGee wrote:
On Aug 12, 12:53 PM, AnotherAstorian wrote:
And Brian, yes I do try to solve problems. On this issue, I’ve written letters to public officials and newspapers, and testified at every public hearing. Unfortunately, many of the silent majority don’t realize how important their voice is.
How can you encourage others to get involved when you still choose to hide behind anonymity?
Let Brian be your example. What he’s doing takes a helluva lot of courage and is here under his own name truly trying to make a difference.
That’s the hypocracy of this site.
On Aug 12, 2:30 PM, James Kirk wrote:
On Aug 11, 10:50 AM, Patrick McGee wrote:
I have asked her to tell us what she believes it is the citizens of Clatsop County truly want.
In regards to what? People’s desires are vast and varied. You ask some vague question then it’s no wonder you don’t get an answer.
On Aug 12, 3:07 PM, Dena wrote:
You use words ignorantly, McGee. How can the site be hypocritical? YOU are the hypocrite as EVERYONE knows you use fake names on all of the forums and yet you berate others for doing so. Get it through your thick skull. Some of us are FORBIDDEN to engage in public debate, using our names as it represents the entity we work for. It is part of the work contract. With others it is a tacit agreement that doing so will get you severe repercussions. However you want to close down communications I, and many like me, thank God for the opportunity this forum provides to get our thoughts out there.
On Aug 12, 6:25 PM, AnotherAstorian wrote:
Patrick, has it occurred to you that I may have very valid reasons for posting anonymously? I am not HIDING behind my AA name, but having anonymity allows me to speak freely. I happen to have some close connections with people involved, and it would probably make their lives very uncomfortable if I posted as myself. Maybe after all is said and done...If it makes you feel better, feel free to call me Charles. I probably should have been posting as Charles all along, since that’s a pretty common name, but then you still wouldn’t know who I was, would you?
On Aug 12, 7:17 PM, Patrick McGee wrote:
That’s bullshit AA.
I’m going to challenge, criticize, assassinate, etc.?
You or anybody else, at least, deserves the courtesy of knowing who’s doing it and I hold myself accountable for what I say and I don’t really concern myself with what others think.
You?
You AA or Charles are still a nobody till you face the world under your own name and not be afraid to do so no matter what your peers say
You don’t speak freely, you are nobody with no valid opinion except on Rags like this thing.
On Aug 12, 9:25 PM, Ann Samuelson wrote:
For the sake of people feeling as though they can share their ideas I understand why some feel the need to be anonymous. From my perspective I am not that concerned about the who here, it is what we can take from it to improve and change for the better. I see this as a community building opportunity.
On Aug 12, 9:47 PM, Patrick McGee wrote:
Heard that one before Ann.
Don’t think this is quite the way to do it really.
On Aug 12, 10:51 PM, AnotherAstorian wrote:
Patrick,
I’m sorry that I’m not in a position to tell you who the hell I am, not that I feel compelled to do so. Damn, you piss me off! You are so holier than thou.
Just because YOU are in a position to be WHO YOU ARE, doesn’t mean the reat of us are.
On Aug 13, 12:16 AM, Josh Witt wrote:
Patrick McGee wrote
Don’t think this is quite the way to do it really.
Well, no one is forcing you to do it this way, are they?
Why dont you leave editorial and posting policy to those who own and administrate this website instead of constantly bemoaning the fact that you dont know someone’s name?
In spite of all your b.s. it’s about what is said, not who is saying it. If you find that so distracting why do you even bother to come here?
On Aug 13, 7:17 AM, Patrick McGee wrote:
On Aug 13, 12:16 AM, Josh Witt wrote:
In spite of all your b.s. it’s about what is said, not who is saying it. If you find that so distracting why do you even bother to come here?
And this is all you have to say?
Seems this is all anybody playing in this sand box has to say moreso than attempting to find answers and solutions to issues as requested by Commissioner Samuelson.
Want to be smart?
Completely ignore my posts and go about your business but, you won’t.
On Aug 13, 7:30 AM, Patrick McGee wrote:
On Aug 12, 10:51 PM, AnotherAstorian wrote:
Patrick,
I’m sorry that I’m not in a position to tell you who the hell I am,
Just because YOU are in a position to be WHO YOU ARE, doesn’t mean the reat of us are.
I’m in no better position than you, neither is Samuelson.
I don’t agree with her on most every issue, she is to be respected for not taking the cowardly way to try to accomplish whatever it is she thinks this site will do for her.
And you, like most others are so focussed on that asshole Patrick McGee, accomplish absolutely nothing here to the community’s benefit.
On Aug 13, 9:33 AM, Guest wrote:
Patrick, you keep making it personal. This whole thing is about ideas not who states them. Please stop reverting to being a cyber bully every time you comment. If you have something important to add that could benefit the community, then add it. Let’s have ideas and solutions and not the continual personal attacks. If you are incapable of this than restrict your comments to your site and stop dragging this site down to your level.
On Aug 13, 9:43 AM, Patrick McGee wrote:
On Aug 13, 9:33 AM, Guest wrote:
Patrick, you keep making it personal. This whole thing is about ideas not who states them. Please stop reverting to being a cyber bully every time you comment. If you have something important to add that could benefit the community, then add it. Let’s have ideas and solutions and not the continual personal attacks.
Yes, let’s do that shall we.
Your ideas or is this all you got?
I think, so far I am, supported by Rick Balkins and Emil Nyberg and one other lady, the only person injecting any ideas or questions to this farce.
On Aug 13, 9:57 AM, Rick Balkins wrote:
I support you when you are contributing, Patrick. There is some honest truth to what is said by some of these anonymous fellows. The ideas are more important than the person who wrote it whether they identify themselves or not.
On Aug 13, 10:01 AM, Rick Balkins wrote:
There are ideas that you have that I do support from the general level and concept. One is the sports/multi-use community center. Giving youth and adults an avenue to spend their time constructively or at the very least doing activities that are legal instead of less then legal activities. Other ideas for different crowds may be an arcade/gaming center. Perhaps, it might be part of that multi-use facility.
On Aug 13, 10:03 AM, Rick Balkins wrote:
PS: Get off the keyboard to answer the phone once in awhile. :-D
Take care, Patrick